Thursday, 8 February 2024

Bills

Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023

Second reading

Debate resumed.

Tim McCURDY (Ovens Valley) (14:57): I am delighted to get to continue my riveting conversation and contribution on the Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023. I was rudely interrupted, but anyway, we will get back to where I was. I was busy talking about Service Victoria’s need for accessibility and inclusion, aiming to mitigate the barriers to access and usage for individuals with diverse needs and circumstances, and this will involve provisions for the integration of assisted technology design principles to ensure that Service Victoria remains inclusive and equitable in catering to the diverse demographics and capabilities of its users. Acting Speaker Farnham, I am delighted to see you in the chair. And may I say we know that we need to cater for all Victorians. The further we go down this digital pathway, the more we need to cater for all Victorians. The government say they cater for all Victorians, but we know they say one thing and then often cater for those who vote for them; we often find that in our regional seats. That is why I am saying that in this digital highway, this digital pathway we are going down that we are so desperate to get further down, we need to do so inclusively, making sure that all Victorians have that ability to understand and utilise this service. Hopefully, by fostering an inclusive service environment the bill can make an effort to uphold principles of accessibility and equity in the digital service delivery landscape.

I want to touch on a bit of the bill. The main purpose of the bill, as we know, is to amend the Service Victoria Act 2018 to provide for the delivery of functions by the Service Victoria CEO either with or on behalf of non-government entities and to provide for delivery of functions by non-government entities, whether with the Service Victoria CEO or on behalf of the Service Victoria CEO or a service agency. Secondly, it will clarify the purpose of the act. Thirdly, it will set out further functions and powers of the Service Victoria CEO. Fourthly, it will enable the identity verification standard, which is very important, as we move down this track, to deal with the processes governing applications for and the issue, renewal, suspension and cancellation of electronic identity credentials. Finally, the bill sets out to ensure that information management requirements under the act are consistent with equivalent requirements of other acts.

The Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023 came into fruition on the recommendation of the Noone report into the Service Victoria Act. It was statutorily required by section 57 of that principal act. The review was commissioned by the minister, with the final report tabled in this place mid-2022. It was undertaken by Dr Claire Noone. The report recommended largely minor and technical changes to the act that would help to improve the operation of Service Victoria as well as provide a more end-to-end framework, which I mentioned earlier in my contribution. The aim is certainly to make that one-stop shop for digital services from the government. Time will tell whether they can deliver that, and I certainly in all good faith do hope that happens, because we desperately need that.

I also want to be perfectly clear that this end-to-end service delivery is well overdue, as Victoria trails its counterparts in New South Wales and Queensland. There does not appear to have been a political will to move forward with this platform, but I am pleased to see that here in 2024 we are starting to go down that path. Maybe the new year brings new hope that this Allan government is finally starting to listen to others, including the opposition, when it comes to digital technology, because Victoria seems to only have eyes for digging tunnels in Melbourne. We think it is important that we look after all Victorians and all areas, not just spending and wasting all of Victorian taxpayers money on a couple of projects here in Melbourne.

To provide some context here, Service Victoria currently delivers 104 different government services, ranging from licence renewals to rebates and savings finders. For all the boasting, the 2023–24 budget papers set aside $30 million for the delivery of digital services as a specific line item. That is what it was going to cost – $30 million – to get this superhighway up and running in terms of Service Victoria and the digital platform. And now we find – and not surprisingly – that there is a further $60 million set out for the 2024–25 financial year. Who would have thought that the Allan Labor government would have a cost overrun or underestimate what the costs were going to be! We are now talking a further 200 per cent from what the initial investment was going to be. We have now got a further $60 million in the budget, so we have gone from $30 million, which was going to be fully funded, fully costed, to now $90 million. You would hope this is due to the expected doubling of transactions and traffic on the website, but we cannot be sure that that will be the case. Even with most operations run on a cost-recovery basis, it is mind-boggling that there should be such a jump in funding requirements, and I hope that the taxpayer is getting bang for their buck. We know waste and financial mismanagement is in the government’s DNA, and it should come not as a surprise but more as a reminder that the inability to manage money is not a new phenomenon of the Allan government.

I want to discuss some of the main changes that this bill intends to bring and what we can expect from them. I mentioned before the end-to-end service delivery. The bill makes amendments to the principal act in order to make changes to allow Service Victoria to deliver end-to-end service through the app, giving them appropriate provisions to assess and issue various applications, such as licences – VicRoads – without having to pass from Service Victoria to VicRoads and back again if they need support or need verification of an ID or various things. There is a lot of doubling up going on between agencies. This legislation will fine-tune that so the CEO of Service Victoria will have that ability to make those decisions and do those identity checks and various things so there is not a toing and froing, which will save time, make better opportunities and certainly make this work a lot better. It will stop two different departments from doing the same work and of course double-ups of licensing and paperwork et cetera. It remains to be seen whether this will actually be the case or whether departments will just start blaming each other for any work lost in the system, but we will see how that goes in good faith. It is about trying to streamline the process.

Identity verification and electronic ID are also covered. The changes in this section broadly relate again to those end-to-end changes and give the Service Victoria CEO the power to make further inquiries around identity verification on behalf of those agencies. This will improve the identity verification standard for digital ID and will also streamline the process.

Further, these changes will give the user the ability to either consent to the storage of data and documents on the platform for future use around ID or decline for privacy and security reasons. I am very pleased to see that that is offered, because various people have different requirements, different needs and different wants. I think having that flexibility, whether they would like to accept that or decline that, is a choice people get to make.

The government trialled digital drivers licences over the last half of 2023, with a broader rollout of them this year. I say hallelujah to that. I am pleased to see that we are moving down that path with VicRoads and that drivers licences are obviously not that far away from making it onto the digital platform for us. I do like the fact that my fishing licence and some of those other licences are on there, member for Gippsland South. Once we get our drivers licences, we can certainly grow that as we go along. But I am still concerned about the government’s track record on delivering successful outcomes for Victorians, and I also have concerns, as I said before, around the data storage and protections for Victorians, particularly following a brutal couple of years of massive data leaks from Optus and Medibank; we all know about those. Of course the more data we put in one place, the more careful we need to be.

I want to touch on partnerships with non-government entities, which this legislation will now start to allow on the digital platform. Service Victoria will be allowed to enter into partnerships with non-government entities. The changes will open up a new method of interacting with government for businesses, with the legislation allowing Service Victoria to make agreements with non-government entities for the purpose of performing joint functions. This will enable, again, as I said, the one-stop point of interaction for Victorian businesses when they require a government service, making the process less complicated and certainly more streamlined. The details behind this change are still a little light on, as we often find, and there are no clear-cut examples of how these changes will be used. This is one of those line items that we see in legislation where this government says, ‘Trust me, we will get it sorted when it comes to the time.’ We have to hope in good faith that these will roll out and be fair and equitable.

It was identified in the bill briefing that private companies may be able to outsource elements of hiring checks to Service Victoria to streamline processes and reduce costs. With that being said, what steps are being taken to educate businesses about those changes, and how will the government remain competitive with the private sector in this area? What happens if there are delays or businesses are left paying more? That does remain to be seen.

We also have a few concerns that the increased digitalisation of government services will leave more and more people behind. As we know, not everybody is digitally savvy. Not everyone is like Acting Speaker Farnham, who is an absolute wizard when it comes to his phone and his iPad and everything electronic. Not everybody is in that same situation. I look at my mother and father, who are very challenged when it comes to that. They even come to me for support, and I just palm them off to the next generation. In all seriousness, we do have to be careful and always look out for those who are not capable of managing the old iPhone or the Samsung or whatever it might be to get where they need to go. As MPs we all get people coming into our offices with very simple needs. A lot of those needs are resolved by technology and saying, ‘Look, have you got a phone? Can you do this? Have you got a computer? Sit with me, we can help you through that process.’ That is a bigger number than we like. Of course we want to make digital technology and this platform suitable for all those who are digitally savvy. I will say the majority of the population are technologically savvy and can use phones, iPads and computers, but again we always keep in the back of our minds that there are people for whom English is their second language, and there are people who are older and have not taken on the changes that have occurred in the last five to 10 years. We need to bring every Victorian with us, for the want of better words.

There are also those who suffer disabilities, have issues with comprehension, are illiterate or are non-tech-savvy people, as I said. An example of this could be seen with the QR codes and service codes during COVID. How many people do we all know who came along and showed us? When they had been scanning in on the QR code they looked at their phone and they had about a thousand photos of the QR code because they thought they were supposed to take a photo of it. I see the Acting Speaker laughing at that. My father was certainly one of those; he still has a lot of photos on his phone of QR codes. Anyway, it remains to be seen. We will try to bring along even someone who is 93 years old so they are ready for the next time they need to use their phone.

Further to this, by diverting more resources away from the coalface or retail customer support and into online support we need to make sure that those with disabilities, such as visual impairment or dexterity or mobility issues, will not be cut off or left behind as well. Whilst they may have additional support, they themselves are unable to be as independent as they could be due to a potential lack of telephone or in-person agents who they can engage with at the time.

Among all the concerns I have with this bill – and we really want to see this come to fruition – are the data breaches. We want to be careful about data breaches and, as I have been banging on about, making sure that all Victorians get to use it – when I say ‘all’ I mean that 95 per cent of Victorians can manage this on their own, and if others need extra support, that is fine. What I am saying is we need to, I suppose, ‘Keep it simple, stupid’ at the end of the day.

Again, multicultural and linguistic barriers will also need to be addressed. Further concerns have been raised with us. With the continued digital pathway not specifically addressed in the bill, it is a concern that many ethnic communities may suffer reduced service delivery from the government due to a lack of adequate translation online where the level of English used is very low and, as I said before, for some where English is their second language.

The government has proposed to address this issue as it continues to expand the platform. However, it has offered no framework to ease the online switch for these communities. This is an important step that must be taken sooner rather than later. We know that in a diverse multicultural state like Victoria where English is a second language for over a million people, we have to keep that in mind. Especially for older migrants or those newer migrants who are more in need of government services, English can be challenging, which is why I would like to see the government doing more in this space.

Further to this is the general concern around privacy and data retention. With more digitalisation come more chances of a massive data breach through a cyber attack or sheer carelessness or neglect. Victorians are rightfully concerned about their data being secure – again, as I say, on the back of the breaches that we saw with Optus and Medibank recently. By moving all online data into a single database – I know the aim of it is to reduce the chances of a breach as you have got one database rather than many, many databases – there is still that risk of exposure to a major breach if that happens. I get that a single set of consistent laws is important and helps to reduce the likelihood of a mistake happening, but it also leads to complacency and a lack of diversity when it comes to data security.

Again, I still have concerns about the future cost to users not being clearly addressed. The Allan Labor government seems to want to tax anything that moves, and this is an area –

Danny O’Brien interjected.

Tim McCURDY: Thank you, member for Gippsland South; if it doesn’t move, they push it and then they can tax it. This is an issue that, again, we have to get to the bottom of. There is no cost now to individual users – I get that, I see that – but where do we get to as we move further down this digital highway and are totally reliant upon our digital wallet, when we actually do not have a hard licence anymore because it is all in our digital wallet, whether that is two years, five years or 20 years down the track? And when that becomes a factor –

Members interjecting.

The ACTING SPEAKER (Wayne Farnham): Order! There is just a bit too much audible noise.

Tim McCURDY: Thank you, Acting Speaker, I am delighted for that cover. I appreciate it. As I say, if you no longer need a plastic card and it all is in your digital wallet, we have got to make sure that there does not become a cost to access that, whether it is every time you use it or an annual cost to be able to do that. Some on the other side might be able to address that during the debate as it goes forward.

I know I have covered a lot of subjects here, and it is a very important bill. In summary, I want to say that the Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023 represents what is an ambitious endeavour aimed at transforming the Service Victoria platform to better serve Victorians and businesses within Victoria by embracing a multifaceted approach encompassing expanded service offerings, technical advancements, data security measures and stakeholder engagement. The bill should help Victoria out of the digital wilderness and set us on the path to a state-of-the-art digital service delivery just like we have seen in other states like New South Wales and Queensland, who we are well behind. But we can start to catch up.

Through these reforms the bill endeavours to make Service Victoria a responsive platform that empowers individuals and businesses, and let us hope it fosters greater efficiency, transparency and engagement in the public sector. Only time will tell if Victoria heads down this digital highway well equipped and ready for the challenges or we end up with another overcosted, underperforming system that Victorians will detest. I certainly hope that we do not end up with a system like that. We want to end up with a system that people are proud of and will use on a daily basis. I do hope Victoria is guided by New South Wales and Queensland, who already have the runs on the board. We do not need to reinvent the wheel. If they are sensible, they will take advice and guidance from those who have done it before so that we do not fall into traps by reinventing the wheel and then having to revisit it somewhere down the track.

I think we do need to review this as we go, a couple of years into implementation, to ensure that we are not leaving Victorians behind. As I said before, we want to make sure that it is inclusive for everybody. No matter where you sit in the digital platform and where your skills are, you should not be left behind. You can still access your own personal data, licences and all sorts of savings; whether it is a power saving bonus or whatever it might be, you can access it on your phone and you have got the ability to do it. Every member in this house will be able to relate stories on a weekly basis of people who come in to see us and talk to us about ‘How do I do this? How do I do that?’ It is quite a simple function – it is for those of who are doing it all the time. But even those who are not doing it every day of the week should still be able to just use a little bit of common sense and be able to make it work without having to go and get the support of another family member or the next generation down to make sure that they get the service that they need off that website.

My opening remarks were back at about 10:30 this morning, so I feel like I have been going for 4½ hours on this, but there was a break in the middle, I am aware of that.

Tim Richardson interjected.

Tim McCURDY: The member for Mordialloc, I know, needs more. He wants more, and I think he is right. If I could get an extension of time, I could go into more detail about the issues I have with the Labor government, more so than this bill. In all seriousness, I genuinely hope that it achieves the goals that it is trying to achieve. We do not always find that in bills in this place – something comes through with ‘Here’s a bit of detail. The rest will be in regulations. So just hope for the best that we get the results we want.’ But I certainly think that as this goes forward there should be a review a bit further down the track to make sure that people are not being left behind and that it is doing what it set out to do – and maybe a comparison with what others are doing in New South Wales and Queensland. Two or three years down the track there might be an opportunity.

I do hope that this tired, self-centred government will not just look at what they do but will look around. They will broaden their view a little bit. They will see what others are doing and be man enough to say ‘If we’ve got it wrong, let’s fix it’ rather than just forge all the way ahead down this digital pathway and say ‘No, we know what we’re doing; we don’t need anyone else to interfere with it.’ As I say, we will not be opposing this bill, and I commend the bill to the house.

Danny PEARSON (Essendon – Minister for Transport Infrastructure, Minister for the Suburban Rail Loop, Assistant Treasurer, Minister for WorkSafe and the TAC) (15:20): I am delighted to make a contribution on this bill, because I was incredibly fortunate and I was incredibly proud to be the responsible minister for Service Victoria for over three years. I do want to take exception with a number of the comments the previous speaker made. I take on face value what the member said, but it is important to point out a couple of observations. The first thing is: all governments have built up their IT systems, which are in many cases built on legacy systems, systems which have formed the basis of public administration for many years and many decades, systems which were built at a time that predated the cloud. It is not simply a case where you say, ‘Well, let’s just pick up what New South Wales has done and we can deploy it here’, because the systems are very different, and in many cases you have got different functions you are trying to discharge.

The other point to make is that New South Wales did start this journey back in 2011, at a time when technology had radically changed, and what we did as a government was we used cloud-based technology. Why this is important and why the member was wrong in his previous statements is that when you go back to the pandemic we had to look at getting a person’s vaccination certificate, which was not held by the state government. It was held in Canberra. It was held in a mainframe system; mainframe computers are high-volume computers which were from the 1990s. We had to then extract that individual vaccination certificate and we had to put it in the Service Victoria wallet. Now, why the member for Ovens Valley is wrong is because we were using cloud-based technology. We had beaten New South Wales to the punch. We beat new South Wales by probably two to three weeks because of the fact that we had modern technology and cloud-based technology and a cloud-based solution. That is why we were more efficient and more effective.

I raise that in this context because when I became the minister with responsibility for Service Victoria in June of 2020 – and I relinquished those responsibilities in October last year – we were on an incredible journey. It is basically a hockey stick when you look at the number of transactions which were onboarded in the course of that time, and there are now over 100 transactions that can be performed on that platform.

One of the reasons why we were so fortunate and our trajectory and our acceleration has been so rapid is our people. Jo de Morton was the CEO of Service Victoria; she is now the Secretary of the Department of Government Services. You could not find a better public servant in the state of Victoria than Jo. In the heat of the pandemic, when we were trying to work out how to respond to the challenges, every challenge that was thrown at Jo was met head-on and delivered.

Think about this for a moment. Go back to those times. We had public health orders in this state which were operational, and we had to provide the confidence to public health officials that by opening up the economy and using the vaccination certificate and using QR codes – that was the social licence to open up. We could only do that with the technology. We could only do that with Service Victoria. And every challenge that was thrown at Jo throughout that period of time, she delivered on in spades. It gave public health the confidence to say, ‘Okay, if we can track where people have been and if there is an outbreak, then we can get onto it quickly’, and that led to that opening up. Without that confidence that Service Victoria brought, we would not have been able to open up in the way in which we did in the time in which we did, and we would not have had the economic growth that happened as a consequence of that.

Darren Whitelaw is the acting CEO currently. I am not sure if he is the substantive CEO now; he was acting when I left the portfolio. He has been fantastic. Darren and I have worked really closely with the development and the adoption of the digital drivers licence. It is going to be an absolute game changer. The notion that you can just leave your wallet or your purse at home and everything is on your phone – it is all about the user experience. This is just going to be fantastic.

I want to also give a shout-out to Cassandra Meagher, who has been involved heavily with this bill, but also with her work at that time she was fantastic. She was just sensational, because again there were times when we were in that hothouse environment of dealing with a pandemic and trying to respond and trying to make sure we could start to open up the economy in the safest way possible, and technology was the enabler that enabled that to occur. I want to thank Jack Cairns as well, who has done a tremendous amount of work in relation to this bill.

For me one of the great pleasures I derived was going up to Ballarat regularly when I held the portfolio. Walking the floor in Ballarat, the GovHub centre – that is where so many of the people who run the call centre, the people who work on the tools, the people who do that development are. I loved it. I loved walking the floor, because you know what? You might be the minister, but if you do not have your people with you, if you cannot motivate your people and you cannot tell them that what they are doing is so vitally important, you lose them, and if you lose your people, you are gone. Just forget it. For me walking the floors and thanking them and recognising just what a great role they were playing was something that I was incredibly proud of.

Going to the comments the member for Ovens Valley made earlier, as the Minister for Government Services I sat on the DDMM, the digital and data ministers meeting, and that was at the time chaired by Stuart Robert. Stuart has had his challenges since his government was defeated. I worked very closely with Victor Dominello. The great thing about the DDMM throughout that journey was, irrespective of whether we were Labor or Liberal, we were never partisan. We were always about trying to get the outcome. It was about listening and learning and finding ways you can do things better and improve and adapting that great Toyota philosophy of kaizen, continuous improvement – trying to do better, trying to be better, trying to improve the performance. That is why we were able to onboard so many different transactions.

I have spoken about the vaccination certificate. When we decided we wanted to have the travel and accommodation vouchers as the first step of our fiscal recovery – growing the economy, growing jobs ‍– we were trying to push out those accommodation vouchers, those travel vouchers. We were having tens of thousands of people on the Service Victoria platform getting those vouchers, and it never collapsed. It never shut down. I appreciate the member for Ovens Valley might not know a great deal about this technology, but the load-bearing capacity of this technology is cutting-edge 21st-century technology, and it never failed. It never failed, because the technology was good and we had fantastic people. Again, as I said, we were on that journey, and there was probably a handful, or maybe it was about 20 transactions, when I took over the portfolio in 2020; it is well over 100 now. It is something I am incredibly proud of, that drive.

This is the forefront of public policy administration in this state, and this is about trying to do things better and be more efficient. I think the community expects us as legislators, as public administrators ‍– it is about the user experience. People do not care whether they are engaging with VicRoads or Victoria Police or the Department of Health or the Department of Education. People want to have a seamless experience, and in many respects, if you think about the way in which government has been constructed, it is almost like each department is a factory. Traditionally you would go to a factory for some goods or services or to another factory, and really the direction where we need to take this is we have got to have more of a warehouse distribution approach. We have to look at the fact that you have got different factories – health, education, justice – but are providing services through a common distribution centre, a common warehouse, a common front door, which is Service Victoria. That is the future of public administration in this state because you have got that seamless user experience. You can ensure that citizens can have that ‘tell us once’ approach and that seamless quality experience. That is the promise of Service Victoria. That is the future of public administration in this state.

This bill is really important because it builds on that. We have got to constantly look at trying to improve our performance and to make sure that the statute books reflect common practice. AI is going to present an enormous amount of challenges for us over the next journey, but we have got to make sure that we continually improve and we continue to ensure that the bills that relate to Service Victoria are modernised, and we have to take the community with us on our journey. We have to have their trust. If we do not have trust and buy-in, then we will not achieve our potential in relation to a government or in relation to the platform itself.

I am incredibly proud of my time at Service Victoria. It was just a gift. It was a joy. It was something I am so incredibly proud of. I loved the people. I loved how hard they worked. I loved the fact that they were always up for a challenge. I loved the fact that they were so smart, they were so committed, they were so passionate and they never failed. They never, ever failed. Everything that was thrown at them they delivered. They delivered in spades, and we are the beneficiaries of it. If it was not for the enabling technology, we could not have opened in the way in which we did or in the time in which we did. We would not have had the benefits.

To Jo, to Darren, to Cassandra, to Jack and to everybody at the GovHub in Ballarat and to the developers at Footscray: you guys are the best. I was so grateful to have been your minister, and I am so pleased that this bill is before the house.

David SOUTHWICK (Caulfield) (15:30): Well, as I have said on many occasions, Labor cannot manage money. Labor cannot manage major projects. Life is getting harder under this government. Labor cannot manage the digital economy, and they certainly cannot manage connectivity. If you think that Service Victoria are going to get their act together when you have had a minister that has been asleep at the wheel – we just heard from the Assistant Treasurer now saying how wonderful Service Victoria is – and if you think that they are going to finally get this right, then you are dreaming, you are absolutely dreaming. This government could not organise a chook raffle when it comes to connectivity.

I look at my electorate of Elsternwick, and we have still got people that have to use tap-on and tap-off in their small business for credit card use out on the street, because we have not got connectivity in Glen Huntly Road, Elsternwick. Small businesses do not have connectivity. How in hell do we expect people around the state to be able to connect up to government services when you have got major trading precincts that still cannot get onto the internet? This government is absolutely asleep when they think that they are going to connect up Victoria.

You only have to look back to pre-2010, under the former Premier Steve Bracks, who promised a big, wonderful Myki – a big, bold, wonderful Myki. Well, what happened to that disaster? Five hundred million dollars in a budget blowout – this government is used to blowouts. This government is used to waste. Nothing has changed there, and it was also two years late. And what happened when they finally delivered Myki? You could not use it for buses, you could not use it for trams. Well, do not believe the past, let us fast forward to where we are today. Can you still use Myki like everybody else? Can you use it on your phones? The answer is ‘No’. We are told now that we have got to wait until 2025, maybe, to be able to tap on and tap off using our mobile phones. This is absolutely archaic.

Victoria is stuck in the past. We pay more than anyone else in taxes, but we get the absolute least when it comes to services. Who would believe that we are the highest taxing state in the nation and we cannot even tap on and tap off using our mobile phones? That is what a joke of a government this is – a complete joke of a government. And if any Victorian taxpayer thinks they are going to solve all of this – a digital drivers licence, being able to use all the different services, energy and all the rest of it, being able to compare and contrast, all of it, different websites – it does not consolidate, it does not work.

The minister got up and said how wonderful it all was during COVID. I mean, we were using pen and paper during COVID. We were not using the technology. It took months – 12 months – to get anything organised during COVID, and then finally small businesses had vouchers to give and that did not work. Those vouchers expired; those vouchers could not be used. And the minister today gets up here and he says, ‘Well, you know, we had a great relationship with New South Wales.’ A great relationship with New South Wales? They have been doing this stuff for years, yet we do not pick up the phone. We say, ‘Rather than use what New South Wales has done and catch up, we want to reinvent the wheel and charge taxpayers for it.’ That is why we are broke. That is why we are paying more taxes than every other state, because the Labor government wants to always reinvent the wheel. They know better. They know better than someone else that has already punted, had a go, made mistakes and improved it: ‘No, no, no. Let’s not learn from someone else. Let’s just go out there, reinvent the wheel and slug taxpayers.’ And do you know why? Because it is not their money and they do not care. They do not care how much budgets blow out.

Members interjecting.

David SOUTHWICK: See, they are saying now, ‘Who cares?’ Thirty billion dollars, $50 billion, who cares? Labor do not care about money, because it is not theirs. They have not come here by learning about how to make it, how to lose it, how to fight for it or how to struggle to put food on the table – none of that. It is just easy come, easy go, and at the end of the day who gets slugged? It is taxpayers, and that is what this is. Because today we have got a bill in front of us about Service Victoria. We wanted to connect Victoria at the last election with ways to be able to make it cheaper for residents and small businesses and Victorians. No, no, no, they did not learn from that. What we have got here is a bill in front of us today that all it is going to give taxpayers is a big bill. We do not know how much, because there are no details – no details about all of this stuff, about how they are going to consolidate, about how they are going to roll it out or about who it gets rolled out to. None of that. It is just ‘Trust us and we’ll solve it’. Every single technology project that this government has touched has cost more and more in blowouts, and in many instances they have not been delivered.

You only have to look at our health system. Again, between 2014 to 2018 we had this great promise that they were going to consolidate the HealthSMART of all of the hospitals. We would have been able to, with one lot of records, go from one place to the next, and it would all work. They had eight hospitals in a trial to get that done. What happened to that? They gave up. They put their hands in the air because the budget blew out. The Labor government ran out of money, and the hospitals said they were going it alone. It is still not fixed. We treat our cars when servicing our cars better than we do our families and our patients. We do not have those records and we do not have that connectivity because Labor does not have a clue – and that is what really annoys me, because Victorians are missing out. If you are paying for something and you are paying the highest taxes, you would think you would actually get something for it, but no, we are missing out.

At the last election, yes, we did not have all of the answers, but there were some good policies, one of which was Connect Victoria, which was to connect Victoria with some basic services, some basic infrastructure – things like a fuel-saver app.

Members interjecting.

David SOUTHWICK: The member for Mordialloc and others can laugh about slugging taxpayers money – they do not care because it is not theirs. They laugh about that, but it is not funny when people are paying for Labor’s mistakes. It is not funny when Labor keeps making mistake after mistake after mistake and Victorians pay for it. Connect Victoria was going to have a fuel-saver app to be able to compare fuel prices like they do in New South Wales. That has been going for years, but no, we will not do that. It was going to cost a million bucks, and every single Victorian was going to save up to $800 a year on their fuel. Instead, one of the biggest cost-of-living pressures is fuel at the moment. Labor just put their hands up in the air and say it is not their problem, it is the federal government’s fault.

This government does not want to admit fault for any problem. The cost of living is not their fault. Health being slugged, GP taxes, all the things, Suburban Rail Loop, major project blowouts – they are not their fault. Nothing is this government’s fault. The only thing that is their fault, or certainly something they will own, is when they cut a ribbon. It does not matter how much it cost. It does not matter how much the taxpayer is going to be slugged, they will just cut a ribbon and walk away and leave the mess behind.

That is the situation with this. This is an absolute unfortunate joke of a system where Victorians are unconnected. It is archaic, the fact that we are not. If you look at older Victorians, there is no solution here for older Victorians that do not have the digital know-how – no solution for them. Again, a solution that the Liberal–Nationals put forward at the last election was to be able to use things like Victorian newsagencies, pharmacies and Australia Post as kiosks right across the state so you can go in and connect with government just the same as you can connect with your phone.

You need to have solutions for everybody – not just for some people but for all Victorians – and that is again the fault of the Allan Labor government. They only care for some, not for all. Unfortunately, the some that they do care for are their mates, and Victorians by and large miss out. Life is getting harder under Labor. Victorians are all paying the price, and I think people are finally waking up and saying that Labor cannot manage money and we are all paying the price for it.

Paul EDBROOKE (Frankston) (15:39): Acting Speaker Farnham, it is fantastic to see you in the seat. With indulgence of the house, I just wanted to pass on a thankyou from my father, who was watching the formal apology this morning to those who experienced abuse and neglect in institutional care. It was not until a bit further on in my life that I realised that some of the things that I had taken for granted along my father’s journey were not exactly what I thought they were – for example, some of the physical scars he has got. I just thought, ‘Oh, Vietnam veteran – that’s how they come.’ And often I would say ‘What’s that scar from?’ and Dad would say ‘Oh, a big crocodile bit me’ or something like that – you know, the way men usually deal with their mental health and sometimes physical health problems.

It was not until a little bit later that we realised that some of those scars were from scurvy, from malnutrition, from rickets. He has scars on his arms from cigarette burns from being abused in institutionalised care. There was even a time when he broke his wrist. I went to the doctor with him, and he got scans. I saw what eventually we found out was a shotgun pellet in his hand. From a person who has been through amazing amounts of physical, mental and sexual abuse, I know he wanted me to pass on to the Premier of Victoria that the formal apology actually brought tears to his eyes. Certainly from my point of view he could thank everyone in Parliament. It is once again the Parliament at its best. And to our new member, we try and keep it here at all times. Thank you for your indulgence, Acting Speaker. I know my dad would be pleased with me for saying that, and I think it has acquitted one of my responsibilities to him.

On this bill, we have heard a little bit from some of our Labor government members on this side about how good essentially the Service Victoria app is. Service Victoria currently provides quite a few really handy things but also some things that you take for granted that you think should have been on there ages ago but we did not know we had the app. The app was put into place prior to COVID, but of course no-one even knew what a QR code was before COVID – or at least I did not; I do not want to generalise and talk for other people. You did not, Acting Speaker Farnham? It is good to know. Now everyone knows there is a QR code system. We order our coffees and sometimes food in cafes and whatnot through the QR code system, with things going directly to your table. In a lot of ways one positive to come out of COVID is the fact that we now embrace new methods of IT, and Service Victoria has seen a massive uplift in the amount of people that use it – and why wouldn’t they?

As far as your Ambulance Victoria membership goes, you can renew it, you can update it and you can apply for the new one. You can create your own business profile account, renew your liquor licence and find business permits and licences. There is a savings finder to help with the cost of living, of course. You can apply for your disability worker registration or renew your disability worker registration. There is a Get Active Kids tab where you can apply for those very, very popular Get Active Kids vouchers and update your Get Active Kids voucher provider details as well.

Also, very importantly, it is now something that people expect – to have their identity available online. We know that there is the visual licence trial in Ballarat. I have got a bit of pressure from the learners in my house that want to be able to use their phone for the licence, so hopefully we will roll that out very soon. I think we will. You are able to verify your identity online. You are able to use the Service Victoria app to verify your identity with Births, Deaths and Marriages Victoria, Consumer Affairs Victoria, the Labour Hire Authority, the Residential Tenancies Bond Authority, the Victorian Building Authority and the Victorian WorkCover Authority as well. As far as local government goes, we can also talk about the automatic outdoor fitness approvals and automatic skip bin approvals, footpath trading approvals, roadside trading approvals and pet registration as well. So the Service Victoria app is making things easy for Victorians.

We could also go on to talk about the other offerings from the Service Victoria app – the NDIS worker screening check; you can apply for an update. As we have heard, you can get your junior recreational fishers card, get your senior fishers card, get your registration of interest to hunt pest animals on Crown land, find a kangaroo harvester or get a Victorian miner’s right. Seniors can get their Seniors Card or their business discount card. Of course the sick pay guarantee is accessible via the Service Victoria app as well, as are the Solar Homes rebates and loans. You can renew your registration for your caravan, trailer, motorcycle, truck, boat or any other vehicle. Veterans can get their veterans card. You can get your police check, your working with children check – and that list will keep on increasing over the next few years.

As the Parliamentary Secretary to the Treasurer, Service Victoria does somewhat come in my wheelhouse. I have had the great pleasure of dealing with the minister in charge of the portfolio and also the Service Victoria departmental staff, who have done a great job. The thing that is really obvious, I guess, when you hear the opposition talking about this – ‘Why don’t we have X? Why don’t we have Z? Why don’t we have this?’ – is that dealing with these kinds of apps can be quite complex, whether it be about accessibility, whether it be about people with languages other than English, whether it be about people for whom there is an age gap or whether it be the big one, being privacy and the storage and security of people’s private details. We have seen some pretty dramatic news stories recently about leaks of people’s details. A lot of work has to go on behind the scenes to make sure that whatever new offering there is works well. The due diligence is being done right now on the Victorian driver licence trial in Ballarat.

This bill basically extends on that offering to make sure that we can provide what the community of Victoria needs now and in the future. It will enable end-to-end digital service fulfilment. It will clarify and add to the functions of the Service Victoria CEO for more proactive delivery of improved services. It removes a number of unnecessary provisions as well. It enables external service delivery partnerships, it supports more flexible options for identity verification and it harmonises information management requirements for those applying across government, ensuring information can be used to deliver improved customer services. The bill also addresses a range of minor inconsistencies.

There will be no direct operational change to existing services. The bill aims to introduce more flexibility and improved service delivery as well. Over time the Service Victoria app is going to be expected to lift a lot more weight. There will be a ton of different offerings available on that, and we have to prepare the app for the future. That being said, the independent review that has been spoken about considered the Service Victoria Amendment Act against the digital strategy and domestic and international cases. The review recommended that further changes were required to support digital delivery needs, and this bill implements the independent review’s legislative recommendations, which will support ongoing modernisation as well.

Some people will have you think that there has not been much consultation on this bill and indeed the app. From my experience with those designing the offerings on this app and dealing with the Service Victoria app and indeed the whole department I can say that Service Victoria has consulted with a huge amount of external stakeholders, including but not exclusive to Electronic Frontiers Australia, the Australian Privacy Foundation, the Law Institute of Victoria, the Commonwealth Department of Finance, the Attorney-General’s department and the Australian Criminal Intelligence Commission.

I think everybody in this house would have used the Service Victoria app, and of course there will be some people that might prefer, as we have heard, the New South Wales app. I am not quite sure of the differences. I have used both; they both seem fairly user-friendly. What we are doing with this bill is making sure that the Victorian app that so many people are finding handy to use at the moment is going to fulfil their needs as they come up in the future. Touch wood, we will not have bushfires and different crises that we have to deal with too much, but when we do it will be the Service Victoria app in the future that I think will be carrying the load for people that need to have things dealt with asap to get their needs met in times of an emergency or in the recovery phase of that emergency. With that, Acting Speaker Farnham, it is good to see you in the chair, and I commend the bill to the house.

Kim O’KEEFFE (Shepparton) (15:49): I rise to make a contribution on the Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023. The bill will amend the principal act to provide for the Service Victoria CEO to make agreements with non-government entities for the delivery of functions and the performance of functions jointly, for or on behalf of one another or on behalf of the other service agencies as defined in the principal act. In addition, the bill will clarify the purposes of the principal act and set out further functions and powers of the Service Victoria CEO, including to support digital delivery of government services and to establish and maintain a centralised point of access for government services. Furthermore, the bill will ensure that the processes for the application for and the issue of renewals, suspensions and cancellations of electronic identity credentials are governed by the identity verification standards made by the minister under section 41 of the principal act and ensure that information management requirements under the principal act are consistent and equivalent requirements under other acts.

The Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023 will enhance the capacity of Service Victoria to act as a central point of access for Victorians for end-to-end government services by enabling more government services to be provided online, which will provide Victorians with a simpler, faster and easier access point to government services. As many have experienced, there can be many delays or complicated processes when trying to source information or documents. There have been issues with people trying to get through the application process. Just this week my office was contacted by an elderly couple who were trying to access documents for their son. Their son’s circumstances had changed following a heart attack, and he was struggling with his mental health. His parents had tried desperately via phone to get access to the required forms and documents and were advised there was a 3-hour wait. This is a clear example of where people face lengthy and unacceptable delays. Obviously this couple were not technologically savvy, and it raises a valid point to ensure that the bill has adequate provisions for a range of challenges. Simplifying and modernising the identity verification process and improving administrative efficiencies makes sense, and we do have to ensure that protections are also in place.

The bill before the house will also support the role of Service Victoria in furthering its digital transformation of the Victorian public sector by ensuring that government services can readily adapt to the technical changes of today’s modern society, aligning the information management and privacy requirements applying to Service Victoria under the principal act with those applying to the whole of the Victorian government and enabling identity verification standards to deal with the processes governing identity verification.

As we have seen with the establishment of a new government department last year, the Department of Government Services, Service Victoria was established to deliver modern government services designed around people’s needs and to make it easier for customers to transact with government online at a time and place convenient to them. Right through the COVID-19 pandemic Victorians frequently and consistently used the Service Victoria app by scanning QR code check-ins and through more day-to-day interactions such as car registration payments and ambulance subscriptions. But the Service Victoria app also includes a digital wallet where Victorians can securely store and show their digital working with children check, veterans cards, Victorian seniors cards or even fishing licences.

In addition, through these amendments to the principal act the bill will allow Victorians to access Service Victoria to receive more documents and approvals for services without having to be passed around different parts of government, instead establishing one place for Victorians to go for government services. We want to see a change in the back-office administration that is currently taking place and prolonging this process. We need regulations to deliver new services and reduce the need to obtain ministerial approvals for such operational matters and underlying technology for a new database to create an improved experience for people applying for personal documents. This will see firsthand positive effects and experiences where unnecessary red tape is removed, making it faster for Service Victoria to efficiently operate and deliver more services for the people of Victoria right across the state regardless of their postcode.

Most importantly, the bill before the house will allow for more flexible options for identity verification. We need this bill to align to national and international standards and not the limitations that we have currently been experiencing. The principal act includes complex provisions about applications, processing review and the issuing of temporary and ongoing identity credentials. The changes in the bill will provide more alternative processes for people who are unable to verify their identity online, which will allow existing services to be moved to Service Victoria more quickly and efficiently. We need to support and facilitate more customer-friendly processes for Victorians. Most importantly to note, the verification of personal identity is crucial for protection, and we must have software and protections in place so identity online cannot be undermined or harmed. Victorians should have confidence in knowing that their personal identity will be protected, not be fearful of their personal identity being stolen or harmed through weak software, and know that they have protections in place.

The bill seeks to repeal an unused identity verification review pathway to the Victorian Civil Administrative Tribunal that has allowed a customer to seek review of decisions about verifying their identity. Since the provision was introduced in 2018 Service Victoria has verified over 1.5 million customer identities and no customer has sought a review by VCAT. Although there are several areas of concern within the bill, such as digital inclusion and accessibility, there are some concerns that the government’s continued push towards more digital interactions for all government services will mean it is difficult, if not impossible, for those who suffer from disabilities or issues with comprehension, are illiterate or innumerate or are not tech savvy. A case study of this can be seen with the use of QR codes and the Service Victoria app during the COVID-19 pandemic, which I have already touched on in my contribution. During the pandemic and the scanning of QR codes, many Victorians were unable to access venues et cetera or were required to fill out additional paperwork due to a lack of ability to utilise modern technology or in some cases a reluctance to use the service.

In addition, further concerns have been raised with the bill surrounding the continuing digitisation pathway that are not specifically addressed in the bill. Many ethnic communities especially across my electorate may suffer from reduced service delivery from the government due to a lack of adequate translations online. Whilst the level of English used is very low and easy to comprehend, it is still difficult for those whose first language is not English. The government have proposed to address this issue as they continue to expand the platform itself. However, it has offered no framework to ease the online switch for these communities, which is of great concern.

Whilst there are some concerns with the broader approach to Service Victoria and digitisation as a whole and the impacts and inclusivity of these changes, the bill in and of itself is largely technical and non-controversial in nature, aligning back-end systems more closely with other legislation, ensuring continuity and compliance. Further, the bill also allows Service Victoria more flexibility to futureproof and make any necessary changes that technological advances will bring. I thank and note the lead speaker of the opposition for his contribution. We will not be opposing this bill.

Anthony CIANFLONE (Pascoe Vale) (15:56): I rise of course to also support the Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023, and it is a bill that is all about us modernising and streamlining the way in which Victorians can continue to access and engage with government services, resources and supports in an increasingly digitised world. We do not have to cast our minds too far back to remember a time when most of our interactions as community members with government and non-government services were largely conducted in person or over a counter. For me, I do fondly remember my early years growing up and accompanying my mum for a walk down to the bustling Sydney Road shops in Coburg during the late 1980s and early 1990s, where she would conduct most of our family’s affairs along the strip. She would drop by the local bank branch with her bank book in tow to withdraw the funds needed for the shopping trip ahead – not an Apple iPhone or Wallet in sight.

We would then stop by the Australia Post office to mail some letters or pay some bills with the money she had just withdrawn, long before the days of email or Bpay. We would swing by the local Medicare office if there was a health-related matter or refund she had to finalise – again, long before any Medicare app or health refund app. We would then stop by the local butcher, fruit shop and fresh food market, with my mum closely inspecting all the produce she was about to purchase in cash, well before the days of click and collect or Uber Eats.

If she had an opinion and wanted to vent about a local issue, she could pop by the then local member’s office at 3 Munro Street, Coburg – who was then Bob Hawke – to vent her grievances to Bob’s welcoming and sympathetic electorate officer Mimi Tamburrino. But unlike the previous examples, my mum and others can still do that, because Mimi is my electorate officer. If we had to pay the car rego of my dad’s red VK Holden Commodore, we would head into the then landmark VicRoads buildings in Lygon Street, Carlton.

While many of these interactions now seem like a rarity and not the norm, especially for gen X, gen ‍Y and gen Z increasingly, the reality is it was not that long ago when the vast majority of our interactions as a community with government and non-government services were done in person. But fast-forward to 2024, and of course digital technology has fundamentally changed the way in which we all live, work, shop, travel, connect with family and friends and interact with each other, with digital technology now touching almost every aspect of our lives. And whilst there are tremendous advantages associated with the ongoing evolution of this technology, including for business, workers and the general community, which this bill will continue to facilitate, I am also very passionate about ensuring that as we become more digitised as a world and a community, no Victorian is left behind, particularly from a migrant or culturally, linguistically or other diverse community.

Just like my mum used to enjoy her Sydney Road outings almost four decades ago, she and many of her contemporaries who migrated here of non-English-speaking backgrounds from Italy, Greece, Türkiye, Lebanon and many other parts of the world simply do not have the digital literacy capacity or access to technology that many of us have been raised with and take for granted. To this very day she and many in her community and age bracket prefer that approach. In fact, as set out in our government’s own digital economy strategy, almost 2.5 million Australians remain offline – that is, people who do not have access to technology or digital skills – and one in 10 do not have access to a personal computer, many of whom are our most vulnerable. But that is why I am very pleased that along with this bill we are continuing to ensure accessibility and inclusion through all of our government services for those who choose not to engage or cannot engage online, by making alternative channels available for every transaction, and by providing offline services and channels for people to complete applications or prove identification and by making physical forms or payment processes available too. And a lot of those times, as I am sure many of us can attest, that happens through our local electorate office.

If the COVID-19 pandemic taught us anything it is that many parts of our economy and community can work and function in a more hybrid, flexible and sustainable manner too. Prior to the COVID pandemic 19 per cent of people chose not to engage with government services online, and now that is down to 8 per cent. Given that all members of our community have virtually no choice but to engage with government services, we have to move as a state towards enhancing our digital service offerings across the public sector and services.

As set out in the Victorian government’s digital transformation strategy, we are working towards this through three pillars: creating better, fairer and more accessible services across government; building a digital-ready public sector; and fostering a thriving broader digital economy that will create jobs. One of the key pillars in this strategy of course is Service Victoria, which this bill today is all about. People have completed more than 1 billion transactions through Service Victoria, including using QR codes for check-ins during the pandemic but also paying car regos and ambulance subscriptions and for vouchers and cashbacks to help reduce the cost of living. Customer satisfaction is reported to be more than 95 per cent, with the most common feedback being that it is very easy to use. The Service Victoria app of course includes a digital wallet, where Victorians can securely store and show a digital working with children check, a seniors card and also a Victorian veterans card, which I will touch on in a moment. I appreciate the Minister for Veterans is in the chamber at the moment. As part of this approach, we need to keep evolving, and that is why the government did create and establish the Department of Government Services earlier this year to oversee the ongoing evolution of the app, which now provides for 100 different government service offerings for the community.

This bill will continue to make it even easier and simpler for Service Victoria to deliver digital services by providing a more flexible and principles-based legislative framework and by streamlining customer services through the Service Victoria app and process. Parts of the bill that are quite significant in this regard include where it broadens the definitions in the act to include the definition of ‘customer service function’ and where it amends the list of Service Victoria’s functions to be more principles based so that the platform can deliver more innovative bundled services. The bill also helps reduce back-office administration across government departments, which is currently contained in the act. It will enable more flexible options to identify verification and allow Victoria to align with Commonwealth trusted digital identity frameworks. The bill harmonises information management requirements while still remaining subject to the Privacy and Data Protection Act 2014.

As I said, one aspect of the bill that I am particularly passionate about relates to the role of Service Victoria in how it will continue to support our veterans community by facilitating access to the new Victorian veterans card. In one of my previous roles I had the absolute pleasure of being the veterans adviser, as was the now member for Lara in this chamber, to the former Victorian Minister for Veterans John Eren, who was just here earlier today, as we know. It was a particularly enjoyable and humbling experience to work alongside Minister Eren and to travel the state and advocate on behalf of and meet with so many veterans across every community and corner of this beautiful state. The period was particularly important given that we as a nation were at the time commemorating the centenary of the First World War and the Anzac landings at Gallipoli. With Minister Eren being of Turkish descent – just as today’s minister is – the work carried that extra level of meaning and significance.

I was very proud of the work that we achieved during that time under Minister Eren’s stewardship, which has laid the pathway for the minister of today. We continue to work with the Victorian Veterans Council. We invest in the Shrine of Remembrance. We unveiled the Australian–Turkish friendship memorial. We commemorated the 50th anniversary of the Battle of Long Tan, and I acknowledge the member for Frankston’s father’s service in that regard. We successfully advocated for the then Liberal federal government to ensure the 2021 ABS census specifically sought information on the veterans community for the very first time, and we established the landmark Victorian veterans employment strategy, which continues to support newly returned veterans.

But of course there is always more to do. That is why on 6 November 2022 the Labor government made an election commitment to develop and implement a new veterans card for Victoria. The card is designed to be a meaningful and symbolic way to say thank you to our veterans for their service and their sacrifices and to also help them with cost-of-living relief by providing discounts on a range of services and initiatives. The card is now being delivered as a digital card through the Service Victoria app – as of 1 July 2023 – and the reforms contained in this bill will continue to ensure it expands its reach and access. I commend the Minister for Veterans on her stewardship in overseeing the rollout and her team and department in that regard. This will help support 60,000 Victorian veterans who are not currently eligible for the Commonwealth Department of Veterans’ Affairs gold card and associated concessions. We are delivering this by a $36 million commitment over four years. There are a range of discounts that veterans who take up the card will be eligible for – 13,000 veterans to date have done so.

I have been doing everything I can in my local community to promote take-up in that regard. I was very honoured to welcome the Minister for Veterans to launch the local veterans card in my community on 12 August 2023 by visiting the Coburg RSL. The RSL was formed in 1918 and is one of Melbourne’s oldest continuing and operating RSL sub-branches. It is older than the Shrine of Remembrance, which was established in 1934. Alongside 100 local RSL members, who included branch president Michael Pianta and retired army chaplain Reverend Mark Dunn, it was a pleasure to have the minister talk to local veterans about the card being rolled out.

We used the occasion to commemorate a lifetime local resident and longstanding local veteran Des Bourke, who served our nation during the Vietnam War as part of A Company, 5th Battalion of the Royal Australian Regiment. Des was called up to national service on 30 June 1965 and served two years being deployed as a frontline soldier for his first tour in Vietnam, between 1966 and 67. His battalion conducted 18 separate operations, in which tragically 25 men were killed, with a further 79 wounded in action. Des was repatriated out of Vietnam due to injury and illness, and legend has it he did more in two years than 10 full-timers did in seven years. Since his return Des has continued his selfless service to our community and the RSL for over 50 years, doing basically everything at that RSL that you could imagine possible as well.

We also subsequently conducted a service on 3 August 2023 to commemorate the 13 local residents who were killed in action in Vietnam at the Fawkner cemetery. They are still buried there today. It is quite fitting, I think, that this is a Service Victoria bill that builds on the service and legacy of the veterans of the past.

Brad ROWSWELL (Sandringham) (16:06): I also rise to address the Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023. I commend the member for Ovens Valley, my colleague from the National Party, for his work as the responsible shadow minister in preparing the opposition’s position on this bill. It has been well circulated and it should be well known at this point in time that we do not intend to oppose this bill. That said, that does not mean we do not have some views on this bill on behalf of the people that we represent in this great state and in our communities. I look forward to the member for Evelyn’s contribution. The member for Caulfield did an outstanding job. He has a very good sense of all things digital and has a very long, abiding interest in such matters as well.

I want to draw my contribution today very narrowly on the fact that Victoria is behind the eight ball when it comes to digitalisation. I simply do not think that that is acceptable. I look to our near northern neighbours in New South Wales and think of what they have been able to achieve and how easy it is for people in New South Wales to access their government and digital wallet all the same. Basic things like a drivers licence can be accessed by those New South Wales residents thanks to the vision of the New South Wales government.

I want to pay a special tribute to a former minister of a former coalition government in New South Wales, and that is the Honourable Victor Dominello, who had a conversation with the then Premier Gladys Berejiklian and really took the digital agenda in New South Wales from zero to hero in a very small amount of time. New South Wales is benefiting from it. For the first time in that state’s history there was a dedicated minister responsible for the integration of a digital program – a first for our nation – and New South Wales is benefiting from it. It is great that various departments responsible for various things have various data points, but if those data points do not talk to each other to be able to give those decision-makers, those ministers of the Crown, the information that they need to make the best decisions in the best interests of the people they seek to serve, then what is the purpose of that data? This was the journey; this was the mission and the drive behind Victor Dominello’s purpose in digitalisation and making sense of the data that so many departments and government agencies were collecting – something that could be used to drive better policy outcomes, to drive down costs and to assist the people of New South Wales. That is the opportunity for us here in Victoria. I am sad to say I really do not think that we have done nearly enough in this space.

There is opportunity in the future for us to do more in this space. I contend that we perhaps have not done as much in this space and this has not been an agenda item for this government, now in its 10th year of governing, for the simple reason that money has been spent – money has been wasted – elsewhere. I have said it in this place before and I will say it again now: there has been more than $38 billion of waste on major projects in the last 10 years. Is it any wonder that very worthy causes, very worthy pursuits, such as the digitisation agenda and pulling all those departmental and government agency data points together so they can be made sense of, so they can help in better policymaking and so they can help the people of our state and hopefully deliver budget efficiency as well just have not been a priority?

I note an article in the Age newspaper from 8 May 2023 written by a member of the fourth estate known to some people in the chamber today, I suspect – a chap by the name of Broede Carmody. Mr Carmody wrote in the Age newspaper:

Victoria is finally catching up to NSW and South Australia when it comes to digital driver licences.

Fully licensed drivers will be able to apply for a paperless permit from 2024, the Andrews government confirmed on Monday.

When I first saw that in May 2023 I did a little happy dance actually. I was quite pleased about that. I thought, ‘About time.’

Juliana Addison: Could you show us the happy dance if you are going to refer to it?

Brad ROWSWELL: I seek your protection, Deputy Speaker, from the member for Wendouree. That is disorderly.

The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! Dancing is disorderly.

Brad ROWSWELL: Thank you, Deputy Speaker. I am grateful for your protection. I did a little happy dance only because I thought, ‘Well, about time.’ There was an opportunity for us to, for once in our lifetime, head out – when we were allowed to, when we were not in lockdowns – add to the Victorian economy, spend money, go out, and all we needed to take was our phone. We could leave our wallet at home. Whoop-de-do! What a great joy that would be. But no, you cannot do that at the moment. You cannot do that at the moment because we have not got a digital drivers licence just yet. But it is happening. It was promised to us by the Andrews government during the course of last year. Well, it is 2024. Mr Carmody, who I know to be a good and honourable journalist, has reported here that we will be able to apply for a paperless permit from 2024. By my measure it is 8 February in the year 2024, and crickets – that is what I am hearing from the Allan Labor government. But I look forward. I know that there are some advisers in the chamber here today, and perhaps they can take that back to the minister. At least those on this side, we want our drivers licences to be digitised so we can leave our wallets at home and we can just take our phones with us when we go out and support our local economies and local communities.

There is an issue though. In making that announcement in May 2023 there was no indication from the then Andrews Labor government that anything other than digital drivers licences would be added to your Service Victoria app. My mum does not drive a car and therefore she does not have a drivers licence, but when she needs proof of identity how does she use that digital technology?

Juliana Addison interjected.

Brad ROWSWELL: Sure. Member for Wendouree, I will be disorderly and take you up on the interjection. You are absolutely right. It is never too late for you, member for Wendouree, to be right on something, and here we go. Yes, you are right – a proof-of-age card. Exactly. My mum has a proof-of-age card, but there is no plan by the government in this bill, the Service Victoria Amendment Bill ‍2023, to enable something like a proof-of-age card to be digitised and to be included as part of your digital wallet.

Juliana Addison interjected.

Brad ROWSWELL: Stay tuned, says the member for Wendouree. Stay tuned. If I was being discourteous to the member for Wendouree, I would potentially suggest that that was policy on the run, that that was a commitment by a member of the Allan Labor government to digitise proof-of-age cards in the same way that the government intends to digitise drivers licences, but I will not suggest that because I have more courtesy and respect for the member for Wendouree than that.

I will end my contribution there other than to say we have an opportunity in this state to do better than we have done. New South Wales and South Australia in this space are far ahead of us. I am not putting any mayo or GST on that comment, that is just a matter of fact. We do need to catch up. We do need to catch up quickly. It is the right thing to do to digitise our processes and to use our data in a better way that delivers better outcomes for the people of Victoria, better policy outcomes, perhaps in this economic climate financial efficiencies and, above all else, an easier, simpler system for every Victorian.

Juliana ADDISON (Wendouree) (16:16): I am delighted to rise, following on from the member for Sandringham, to talk about the Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023. I am standing up to support this amendment, which will further improve the delivery of digital government services across the state and which is something that I know we are all incredibly interested in as we move forward. It was great to hear the contribution from the member for Pascoe Vale, who is always a very engaged member.

This is important legislation, and I am very pleased to speak to it. I would really like to thank the Minister for Government Services, her ministerial office and the department for bringing this bill to the house. I would also like to acknowledge the input of the department agencies and non-governmental stakeholders that were consulted, which includes the Victorian information and health complaints commissioners, the privacy foundation, the Law Institute of Victoria and all of Service Victoria’s partner agencies.

I fundamentally believe that it is paramount that citizens are able to engage and access government services in my community and across the state. I think many of us know and would say that navigating government services can be challenging on a good day and near impossible when your life is in crisis or when you are unwell or when you are a vulnerable Victorian. Service Victoria provides a convenient, easily accessible and central point of access for Victorians to a variety of government services. Not only is it customer-friendly, it is digitally supported by modern IT infrastructure, which has facilitated the completion of almost 15 million activities during the most recent financial year – 15 million. It is amazing if you think of the population of Victoria and these interactions – so important. This number does not surprise me given that the platform supplies end-to-end access to over a hundred customer services from right across government.

I am very proud to have so many Service Victoria staff working in my electorate of Wendouree in our purpose-built $100 million Ballarat GovHub building, as well as VicRoads, Consumer Affairs Victoria, Working with Children Check Victoria, the State Revenue Office, Regional Development Victoria and other departments, including the Department of Education. Our GovHub has centralised the delivery of a range of government services, making it a one-stop shop for customers and a hub for local activities. We have delivered on our Ballarat jobs promise with workers in the hundreds, with hundreds of new jobs and with relocated positions now based in central Ballarat. It is terrific to talk with government employees who have chosen to relocate to Ballarat about how much they enjoy living in our city, with everything that Ballarat has to offer not only for them but also for their families. These new jobs, as well as the construction, have strengthened our local economy. The construction of our GovHub, headed by contractor Kane and local builders Nicholson in a joint venture, was a major boost for the local and regional economy that created 500 jobs and supported more than 60 companies not only from Ballarat but from across the region as well in Bendigo and Geelong.

I am very disappointed that the Shadow Treasurer is walking out, because I am going to make references to him, and I want him to stay. If your time is not too valuable, just hang on a minute.

I have had the opportunity to meet with Service Victoria staff onsite and see the work that they are doing, and I am particularly pleased that Ballarat was chosen as a site to trial the digital Victoria driver licence, which I conveniently have on my phone in my Service Victoria app wallet. Since July Ballarat residents have been able to register their interest to participate in the pilot through their myVicRoads account or from the Service Victoria website and add a digital version of their licence to their phone. I know the member for Sandringham would love to move to Ballarat just so he could do that. But I am sorry, it is really important you stay by his side, and I will keep the home fires burning in Wendouree.

The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Through the Chair.

Juliana ADDISON: There are a number of benefits to the new digital licence – I am sure the house will appreciate this – including that it is more secure than a physical licence and can be updated to reflect changes, including a new address or new licence conditions. I am sure that many digital natives, as well as the member for Sandringham’s mother, will in time be sure to use this for ID or proof of age rather than carrying a physical card like a proof-of-age card, but I do not want to get ahead of myself. I have got to be very cautious on that front.

With Service Victoria there are other digital solutions. I know there is a healthy rivalry between New South Wales and Victoria, but I think if the member for Sandringham was more interested in promoting all the good things happening in Victoria rather than that mob north of the Murray, he would be very excited to know the things we are now able to do: get a recreational fishing licence or a Victorian miners right – going all the way back to the goldfields and Eureka – now in 2024 with Service Victoria. There is also the digital seniors card – I do not want to jump to conclusions, but perhaps Mrs Rowswell might be interested in also having that – and a digital veterans card.

Service Victoria is also providing great services. Many have been able to apply for the Get Active Kids vouchers. That is really, really good. As we know, these important Get Active Kids vouchers help kids and families to afford club memberships, fees, uniforms and equipment. In partnership with local governments, Service Victoria also provides automatic approvals for permits such as footpath trading or outdoor fitness, streamlining processes for business to the benefit of communities – with participating councils, I note. Just a word to the City of Ballarat: you are not on that list yet, so we have a little bit of work to do there, but I know that many other councils are involved in this.

We have all been talking a lot this week and for the last couple of months about cost-of-living pressures. That is why it is so important that there is also the savings finder available through Service Victoria, which shows Victorians a huge range of rebates and discounts that are relevant to them. More than ever in this cost-of-living crisis we are all looking to make savings, and I encourage every single person to take full advantage of checking the savings finder online with Service Victoria.

One further program I really want to highlight that I am so proud of is the sick pay guarantee, which is accessible through Service Victoria. It is our nation-leading policy that is a game changer for casual and vulnerable workers. This is where casual and contract workers can check their eligibility and sign up for the guarantee as well as where they can then make a claim if they need to. No worker should have to choose between not heading into work when sick and earning a living, which is why our government’s sick pay guarantee pilot program is so crucial, and the key to making it accessible is Service Victoria.

It is not enough for programs such as this just to exist. To be of any benefit they must be easy to find and straightforward to navigate, and that is exactly what Service Victoria provides. As I have already said, it is paramount that citizens have easy access to services. This is not only for my constituents living in Wendouree – every single Victorian needs to have ease of access. All of these programs are available thanks to the Service Victoria Act 2018, which originally outlined the core priorities for the agency. The act has since been updated, most recently in 2022, with targeted amendments that addressed specific needs arising from the COVID-19 pandemic.

With this bill that is before the house, the proposed amendments intend to better clarify the purpose of Service Victoria as an agency and to create the legislative framework to further enhance service provision. These amendments were also informed by the independent review into the act which followed its three-year anniversary. I would like to acknowledge Dr Claire Noone for her work in leading this review and the dozens of stakeholders consulted for their input.

In light of this review’s recommendations, the bill before us proposes several amendments to the Service Victoria Act 2018 with the intention of supporting and enhancing the provision of government services via Service Victoria so we will be able to enable the delivery of more end-to-end and innovative digital services; provide better and more flexible identification verification, as raised by the member for Sandringham; enable services delivery partnerships to create streamlined and secure customer experiences; as well as further harmonising information management practices under the act with those across government.

In my final remarks I just want to say that this bill improves provisions regarding electronic identity credentials in addition to laying the framework for the agency to provide identity verification to non-government entities. I commend this bill to the house. I commend the workers at Ballarat in the GovHub.

Bridget VALLENCE (Evelyn) (16:26): Today I also rise to speak on the Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023, and at the outset I will refer to the government’s media announcement about this change and this boost to digital services through Service Victoria for the Victorian government and the people of Victoria. The title of that media release was ‘Digital services to make life easier for Victorians’. I appreciate that we are bringing in the bill today and we are debating the bill today; however, I think that could not be further from the truth, because this Allan Labor government loves a headline but fails dismally on delivery each and every time.

I was listening to the minister earlier today, Minister Pearson, who referred to the fact that this is about kaizen and continuous improvement and that with this bill they are at the forefront of public administration, yet we are only bringing in a bill today, debating it today in 2024, that is going to bring digital services finally, once and for all, to the Victorian public. They are years behind, and it is really quite astonishing. You look at other jurisdictions around the country who are miles ahead when it comes to their service apps to the benefit of the people that they represent, and yet you have got the Allan Labor government who – I have no idea what they have been doing.

In terms of Minister Pearson’s suggestion that this bill indicates that they are at the forefront of public administration, I will pick up on a point that the member for Wendouree also raised, and that was around the digital drivers licence pilot rollout to the residents of Ballarat. I refer to an article in the Age published in June 2023, which refers to this particular pilot program for the drivers licence in the Service Victoria app, and the title of this article was ‘Not a scam: VicRoads blames technical error for digital licence bungle’. So whilst the member for Wendouree would like to claim that this was a great pilot program that she signed up to and got her digital drivers licence through, it was an absolute bungle and a complete embarrassment. And if that one addition to the Service Victoria app is any indication about how this government is going to roll out this service, it is quite embarrassing.

Ballarat residents received a text message saying ‘Be the first to get your licence on your phone’, but there was a significant problem, the problem being that people’s surnames were incorrect, and so all those Ballarat residents thought that this was a scam. This is a demonstration of the Victorian government thinking that they are actually helping people and people thinking that it is a scam. They botched it so badly and there was such a poor uptake of this pilot for the digital drivers licence because everyone was concerned it was a data breach. Everyone was concerned that someone was scamming their phone and could access their data and details and perhaps scam money from them. This is what this Allan Labor government is doing.

So they are bringing in this bill now, but I am totally unconvinced that the government are actually going to get this right. They say they are going to add more and more services to the Service Victoria app, but I am completely unconvinced that they will get any of it right. In fact while Minister Pearson said that he felt this was a game changer, states such as South Australia and New South Wales have had a digital drivers licence on their service apps since before the COVID-19 pandemic, and we were only rolling out a pilot last year for another 12 months to actually have it running across the state. That remains to be seen – whether it will actually run fully across the state. I certainly have my doubts, and I think Victorians do too. Also, the government has still failed to indicate if, when it does finally get rolled out, drivers will get a discount on their licence renewals if they switch over to the new system. I think in a cost-of-living crisis, under the Allan Labor government, that Victorian motorists deserve relief on their licence if they switch to a digital platform rather than the old paper-based one. So that could be something that we hopefully see – an announcement from the government in the future – but I will not hold my breath.

The media release of 23 May 2023 about this particular program indicated that the government was ‘supercharging’ this Service Victoria app with $90 million of already guaranteed funding. So I had a bit of a look at the state budget. That indicated that in the 2023–24 budget there was $90 million allocated to Service Victoria for delivering digital government services. If I look back at the budget prior to that, the 2022–23 budget, there was $86.5 million allocated for the very same thing. So the question I guess Victorians have, rightly so, is: has the government already blown this out by more than double – by another 90 million – because they completely underestimated the scope of the back-end work that is required with the digitisation of these various services in the app? I would hazard a guess that that is the case. So with $86.5 million allocated in the 2022–23 budget and a further $90 million for the very same thing in the 2023–24 budget, this is a very, very expensive piece of infrastructure. I would say had they done it years ago, had they scoped it properly and had they had some better commercial sense and negotiating ability, they might have been able to get a better outcome for the Victorian taxpayer. Obviously that is of some concern. We really, really hope that this government can actually deliver this digital infrastructure with the money that they have allocated, but probably, like every other project, whether it is the West Gate Tunnel or the Service Victoria app, the costs are likely to blow out. The odds are that they will blow out the budget on this project too.

The government indicated in their media release that this investment in Service Victoria will be delivering more digital services but it would not be possible without strong cybersecurity. That is one of the concerns that we have with this bill and with this program. I think it is important that we bring the state’s services up to the digital age, so to speak. But given that the government has already indicated that it requires strong cybersecurity to bolster such digital services through the Service Victoria app, what the government has failed to do, in my view, is to give Victorians any assurances or certainty that there will not be cybersecurity breaches with this app and with these services. That requires some quite sophisticated back-end work with IT and communication service providers and contractors, and it requires the government and the bureaucracy to have a level of understanding when they are scoping and undertaking this work. I do not think with all of the IT programs that the government has rolled out in the past couple of years they have demonstrated that there is sufficient capability in the department to do this, so we would have some concerns about the cybersecurity element. We hope that the government will get that right, but we would hope that the government will come out with some assurances to the Victorian public that there will not be any cybersecurity breaches.

Just in conclusion, the Assistant Treasurer, the then Minister for Government Services, said in the media release:

Victorians want to get basic tasks done simply and efficiently – that’s why we’re working to make Service Victoria a one-stop app …

We’re streamlining processes and putting common sense at the front of our services …

But the reality is that Victoria is so far behind everywhere else in the country when it comes to this. Victorians are being punished because of the incompetence, the financial mismanagement and the service delivery mismanagement of the Allan Labor government. We will not be opposing this bill, but I certainly hope that those assurances will be provided by the government to the Victorian public.

Nathan LAMBERT (Preston) (16:36): I also rise in support of the Service Victoria Amendment Bill 2023, which amends the principal act, the Service Victoria Act 2018. For the benefit of the member for Evelyn, who somewhat implied this was our first legislation in this area, it not only amends the original act but of course is a further set of amendments after the Service Victoria Amendment Bill ‍2021.

It is a pleasure to speak on a bill that primarily deals with software development and relational databases. I did have a chance in my own working life to do a little bit of that work, but I was mainly a very interested spectator as some very ingenious people over the last few decades solved all these problems of how to store data online, query it and then make it available to people across the web and across mobile devices. I think almost every large organisation in this state has been through the journey of having to, first, implement databases and then make that information available to people in an interactive way. It has been very substantial work for those organisations. Of course the Service Victoria app, which we have been discussing today, is at the forefront of the Victorian government’s journey along that database path. I just really want to stress that with the Service Victoria app the things that Service Victoria are trying to do are complex and hard. If you open up your phone, it is certainly my instinct, having worked in the area, that the app that they are trying to build is a lot more complex than Instagram. It is a lot more complex than your banking app. It is probably the most complex app in your phone. I say this because I want to disagree quite strongly with the nature of the remarks of the member for Caulfield in particular, who essentially stood up here and said, ‘Well, it’s easy. Why didn’t it all happen five years ago?’ I want to stress to him it is not easy.

We heard a lot from the opposition about Service NSW and Victor Dominello and the work they did. I acknowledge that that was a well-run organisation, Service NSW, internally, but I think it is a complete mischaracterisation to not acknowledge that they went through the same technical bumps, the same integration bumps that we have and in fact moved very similar legislation to the legislation that we are discussing today and probably will continue to do so. I very much agree with the Assistant Treasurer’s remarks to that effect.

I understand there were some Australian Hotels Association drinks held on Tuesday night. We have heard a lot in this chamber this week from the opposition about the AHA and the views of hoteliers. I do not think Labor members were invited, but it is always good to hear the views of hoteliers. I do not deny that. But I just would make the point that it would be good to also hear the views of IT professionals and those who have been involved in large-scale deployment of databases, and I think, from the opposition’s contributions to this debate, that some of that lived experience has been missing.

I do want to step out the reasons why the work that Service Victoria is doing is both important and complex. The first one to remember is that the Victorian government is one of the most complicated and largest organisations in the country. Effectively, Service Vic are building 50 apps, not one, insofar as they have to do central authentication, customer experience and verification for a whole lot of separate departments and agencies that have their own back-end systems and make their own decisions. The second thing is that standards are always higher for government, and that always makes it a more difficult job. I do not step back from that. Standards should be higher for government. A lot of corporations can get away with just serving 98 per cent of their customers; we always have to go to the last 100 per cent. But that does make the job more difficult, and I think it is very important to point out that Service Victoria have been doing a very good job of ensuring that every transaction has an offline component that people can make use of. They go through accessibility audits. They have translations available. They are doing that work. Nothing in this bill will change the fact that they continue to do that work. What this bill is about is the fact that we have historically put in front of Service Victoria some very, very high bars to clear and some very, very strong constraints on their activities – higher bars and stronger constraints than anyone else working across government has had to deal with. Hence we are back here today to realign the standards and the restrictions upon them with those faced by everyone else across the Victorian public service.

I just want to set out that context. It is very, very easy to stand up and say we should have a one-stop digital app, it should be consistent and everyone should be able to talk to government on it, but I just say on behalf of any IT professional involved in that project: that is like saying it is really easy to build a 55-storey skyscraper. Well, it is not easy. It is doable, but you need a lot of very highly trained professionals coordinated over a long period of time to deliver the project.

Turning then to the specifics of the bill, I thought the member for Pascoe Vale did a very good job at summing them up, and I will just touch on them more briefly. Essentially the bill does three things. It broadens the scope of the work that Service Victoria can do, changing the functions set out in section ‍15, further allowing end-to-end delivery and allowing them to take a whole project and make some of the decisions involved with it. There is through those changes some better capacity to deliver integrated services, and I know particularly in the children portfolio the ability of Service Victoria to pick up some of that work of drawing services together and presenting them consistently is a priority for this government and will be a priority going forward.

Secondly, it allows Service Victoria to work more closely with non-government partners. Previous speakers have mentioned the good work of Dr Claire Noone. She cited Australia Post as a possible partner. I think the member for Caulfield cited newsagencies. Going back to my earlier point, Service Victoria work across a lot of departments and agencies who in turn work with a lot of non-government bodies – community housing and so forth – so I think those reforms are sensible.

Finally, the third thing it does is, as I have touched on, remove a lot of very specific regulation to Service Victoria so that instead of being governed by these very prescriptive things in the current act, they instead are governed by the standard Privacy and Data Protection Act 2014 provisions and those in the Health Records Act 2001 and the Public Records Act 1973 and other relevant regulation. There are some other minor tidy-ups in there as well.

I would like to say, if I can, that the division of this bill into parts was not perhaps easy for the lay reader to understand, but I am very grateful to the minister’s office for talking me through those key themes. Ultimately they come back to the point that we are going to make things easier for Service Victoria through this bill, and that is important to do, because we have up until this date been making things more difficult for them. You could ask quite reasonably why it is that we have made things more difficult for them. I note the member for Brighton has actually just ducked into the chamber, and he did make a good contribution to this debate when we debated an earlier version of this bill in 2021. I think he did note that the original bill probably was a little too prescriptive in some places and not prescriptive enough in others. I think we would agree with that.

I think people have good reason to want legislation in this area to be prescriptive, and certainly we have seen some recent examples with Optus and Latitude and Medibank, where we have very good reason to be disappointed in the way people have handled databases and handled people’s information and handled the tasks that are addressed by this bill. If I can just put it on the record, I thought Latitude were particularly disappointing, having had to support some constituents with their issues. They did not make it clear to people that they had acquired a lot of companies on the way through and hence held databases. People got a letter from Latitude who had never heard of Latitude, and I think in hindsight they could have managed that better. But I think it does speak to the difficulty of legislating in this area if we wind back to 2018 when the principal act was drafted. It is clear that sort of thing was not the focus, because I suppose we did not know that we would have the cybersecurity issues that we have had. Then there was a lot of focus on the identity verification components, which really have moved on in a different way since then – I think in a way the community are more comfortable with – so we can remove those parts or repeal part 6 of the principal act and the other relevant parts, as this bill does.

That comes back to perhaps a general point I would like to make, that in my own experience regulating technology is very hard when technology is moving. Sometimes you are too far ahead; very often you are a little bit behind. There is no way to solve that problem. It is always hard to regulate a technology that is advancing and changing in the way it works. The best thing you can do – really the only thing you can do – is to continue coming back to the Parliament and updating things and amending things when you need to, and that is exactly what we are doing here today. I certainly would be very happy to come back and amend the act further if need be.

I would like to thank the minister and their team for their fine work and also the Assistant Treasurer of course, who spoke earlier to his involvement in the Service Victoria program. I certainly want to echo his thanks to the departmental staff and particularly those staff who were involved, as the Assistant Treasurer mentioned, in the COVID period, when a lot was asked of a small number of people and they responded admirably. I would like to thank Claire Noone and her team for their independent report, which I read and thought was well written and which of course drives many of the changes in the bill that we have in front of us today. I think this is a good bill. I commend it to the house.

Mary-Anne THOMAS (Macedon – Leader of the House, Minister for Health, Minister for Health Infrastructure, Minister for Ambulance Services) (16:46): I move:

That the debate be now adjourned.

Motion agreed to and debate adjourned.

Ordered that debate be adjourned until later this day.